Minutes

Database SIG

Thursday 24 February 2005, Kyoto International Conference Hall

Meeting commenced: 2:10 pm

Chair: Xing Li

The Chair introduced the session and explained the agenda.

Contents

  1. Review of previous open action items
  2. APNIC to publish address assignment statistics
  3. Privacy of customer assignment records - project update
  4. Protecting historical records in the APNIC Whois Database
  5. IPv6 routing registry - project update
  6. RPSLng update and future whois/CRISP plans
  1. Review of previous open action items

  2. Xing Li, CERNET

    Presentation [ppt | pdf]

    Action db-18-001: Proposal for establishment of an IPv6 IRR to be referred to the mailing list for detailed discussion of the framework and implementation.
    Update: Open. Status update to be presented later in the SIG.

    Action db-17-002: Proposal for IRR mirroring policy (prop-003-v002) to be returned to the Database mailing list for further discussion.
    Update: Open. No activity on mailing list. The item will remain open. However, if there is no progress by the next APNIC meeting, the item will be closed.

    Action db-17-001: Pending approval at each remaining stage of the policy proposal process, APNIC Secretariat to implement the proposal to protect historical records with an APNIC maintainer (prop-018-v001).
    Update: Done. Implemented on14 December 2004.

    Action db-16-002: Secretariat to implement proposal "Privacy of customer assignment records" (prop-007-v001) in three months.
    Update: Done. Implemented 5 October 2004.

    Top

  3. APNIC to publish address assignment statistics

  4. Toshiyuki Hosaka, JPNIC

    Presentation [pdf]

    The presenter gave an overview of the resource statistics currently published by the RIRs and noted that no assignment data from within allocations was included in the statistics. The speaker also highlighted difficulties collecting assignment data from the APNIC Whois Database since the implementation of the privacy of customer assignments policy. Implementation of the privacy policy has affected the ability for researchers to assess the actual consumption rate of addresses.

    The speaker proposed that all assigned portable and assigned non-portable database records should be collected by APNIC and published as statistics without any data to identify the assignments.

    The speaker presented an example of a possible format for the statistics, but left the implementation details to the Secretariat.

    The presenter outlined the benefits of publishing assignment statistics. Statistics could be useful when assessing address policy proposals in the future. The statistics could also be useful as a tool for measuring the deployment rate of IPv6.

    The presenter noted that the proposal would not conflict with privacy of customer assignments policy.

    Implementation of similar statistics gathering at the NIRs would be at the discretion of then NIRs. However, it was explained that the NIRs' decision to implement similar statistics reports would have an affect on APNIC assignment statistics since the assignment data would be incomplete without NIR assignment data.

    Questions and discussion

    • There was a comment that from a research perspective, it is often useful to take an IP address and find out its country of origin, but that there is also an understanding of the privacy issues sometimes involved in providing such information to researchers.
    • There was a comment from an APNIC Secretariat representative that the Secretariat had evaluated the proposal internally and had reached the conclusion that implementation was possible. However, it was stressed that the statistics may not necessarily include all assignment data since some of that information was held by the NIRs.
    • It was clarified that the assignment statistics would be complementary to the existing RIR allocation statistics.
    • It was suggested that the current RIR allocation statistics format could be extended and used as the format for the proposed assignment statistics. It was confirmed that the actual format of the statistics would be left to the APNIC Secretariat to decide.
    • There was a suggestion that the assignment statistics format should be consistent to allow convergence with other RIR statistics in the future. The APNIC Secretariat agreed to discuss the format with the other RIRs before settling on a final format.
    • The presenter explained that the frequency of publication of the assignment statistics was also an issue left to APNIC to decide, but that the original idea was to have publication at least once a month.
    • An APNIC representative explained that allocation statistics are published daily, so it was feasible to publish the assignment statistics stats daily if needed.
    • An APJII representative reported that APJII also publishes statistics without pointing to IP address.
    • The Chair called for a show of hands on the proposal and noted consensus in favour of the proposal.

    Action items

    • Action db-19-001: Following approval at each remaining step of the policy development process, the APNIC Secretariat will implement proposal prop-026-v001, APNIC to publish address assignment statistics.

    Top

  5. Privacy of customer assignment records - project update

  6. Sanjaya, APNIC

    Presentation [ppt | pdf]

    The presenter reported on the completion of the project to hide customer assignments in the APNIC Whois Database. The proposal to perform this project was first presented at APNIC 17 and was implemented last year. The speaker explained that the motivation for developing the policy was privacy issues driven by both member/customer concerns and legal considerations.

    The speaker explained how members could update private customer records via MyAPNIC and explained the new tools created to help members update private assignment information. The speaker reported that a script is currently being developed to allow members to update private assignments without needing to access MyAPNIC.

    The presenter noted that while there is more assignment data in the private registry than in the public whois database, some ISPs have chosen to keep their assignment data in the public database.

    The speaker reported that there had been some issues with historical resource holders affected by the policy. In addition, there had been feedback that the removal of assignment data had led to a reduction in important statistical information previously available from the database. However, it was noted that this issue was addressed by JPNIC’s proposal discussed earlier in the SIG.

    Questions and discussion

    • There was a comment that the issue in other regions is granularity of customer data. A customer may not mind that their record is in the database as long as contact details are not. In the APNIC region, it was suggested that this option should be considered. It was suggested that CRISP and EPP should settle down before any more proposals on customer data and privacy were put forward.

    Action items

    • None.

    Top

  7. Protecting historical records in the APNIC Whois Database

  8. Sanjaya, APNIC

    Presentation [ppt | pdf]

    The presenter discussed the reasons for the policy and the implementation process. The speaker reported that feedback was received that the notification time prior to implementation was too short.

    The speaker noted that there had been overlaps between the lame delegations project and protection of historical resources policy. To help networks with lame delegations for historical resources, APNIC now allows networks to make a one time change to their reverse DNS data without being subject to the historical resource protection fee.

    Questions and discussion

    • There were no questions.

    Action items

    • None.

    Top

  9. IPv6 routing registry - project update

  10. Sanjaya, APNIC

    Presentation [ppt | pdf]

    The presenter gave an overview on progress to date on the implementation of the proposal for an IPv6 routing registry (prop-025-v001). The speaker summarised the proposal originally made by Toyama Katsuyasu to develop a framework for an IPv6 IRR. The speaker noted that the implementation project is not completed, but is underway.

    The speaker reported that since APNIC had an existing IPv4 IRR, the service would be extended to include IPv6. The RPSLng specification will be used. The speaker explained that some changes would be needed to existing IRR attributes to make the transition to an IPv6 IRR.

    The presenter concluded by stating that the IPv6 IRR should be available by the end of April.

    Questions and discussion

    • There was a comment that the RPSLng Internet Draft will be published as an RFC very soon.
    • The original author of the IPv6 IRR proposal thanked APNIC for progress on the implementation.

    Action items

    • None.

    Top

  11. RPSLng update and future whois/CRISP plans

  12. George Michaelson, APNIC

    Presentation [ppt | pdf]

    The presentation provided an overview of RPSLng and an update on the status of the CRISP WG at IETF.

    The speaker reported that the IP address reg to PS is a little behind the intended schedule, but is underway. The speaker noted that there are now CRSIP-related RFCs available for CRISP on IRIS, CRISP requirements, DREG schema, and IRIS over BEEP.

    The presenter explained that historical address space has made it more difficult to find the authoritative source for some resources, so extra work was needed to resolve the issue. The speaker reported that the WG developed a dchk protocol to support rapid detection of name availability with lower overheads, which could be useful for IP regs as well as the domain regs.

    The presenter summarised some of the future directions for CRISP development. For example, CRISP is currently a query only protocal, but since registration is about data management as well, there is a need to consider EPP. Planning for this integration will happen will throughout 2006.

    The speaker reported that whois and CRISP will run as duel services throughout 2006. He reported that the WG next needed to discuss client software that could read the data. The speaker also identified a need to assist people make the move from whois queries to CRISP query formats.

    The speaker reported that more CRISP developments would be presented at APNIC 20.

    Questions and discussion

    • There was a comment about the possible use of CRISP to help perform distributed IRR queries.
    • There was a question requesting the approximate number of AP people who participate in IETF WG on CRISP. It was explained that the total number of people at a CRISP WG was around 50. While the presenter was not sure of the number of AP attendees at the WG meetings, he was sure that people from the AP were usually present at the meetings.

    Action items

    • None.

Meeting closed: 3:15 pm

Minuted by: Sam Dickinson

Top

Open action items

  • Action db-17-002: Proposal for IRR mirroring policy (prop-003-v002) to be returned to the Database mailing list for further discussion.
    Update: Open. No activity on mailing list. The item will remain open. However, if there is no progress by the next APNIC meeting, the item will be closed.

  • Action db-18-001: Proposal for establishment of an IPv6 IRR to be referred to the mailing list for detailed discussion of the framework and implementation.
    Update: Open. Status update to be presented later in the SIG.

  • Action db-19-001: Following approval at each remaining step of the policy development process, the APNIC Secretariat will implement proposal prop-026-v001, APNIC to publish address assignment statistics.

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